Feb 3, 2021 17:59
3 yrs ago
29 viewers *
French term
poursuivi au titre des mesures de faillite personnelle
French to English
Law/Patents
Law (general)
Court case where a company owes the Fisc lots of back taxes. And the director, M. AAA, has done a runner (gone to the USA and does not reply to LRAR or anything).
"(Annexe 7 :
Etat provisoire des créances)
Dont provisionnel :
000 000 €
INSUFFISANCE D'ACTIF :
0 000 000 €
Que Monsieur AAA peut être poursuivi au titre des mesures de faillite personnelle ou d'interdiction de gérer conformément à l'article L.653-1 du Code de commerce :"
"Sued for personal bankruptcy"? There is 1 hit for this on the InterOuèbbe. I also looked up "sued for bankruptcy on a personal basis" - nada. OTOH there are 135,000 hits for "sued for bankruptcy". And yet the phrase must make the fact of it being *personal* (as opposed to corporate) bankruptcy clear.
Also the whole au titre des mesures de faillite personnelle expression looks a bit suspect. Are these "steps" involved in declaring someone bankrupt maybe? Or are they simply "the procedure" for making someone bankrupt? Either way, how to convey that?
I also looked up article 653 (Légifrance English translation): in the version I saw there's lots about "personal disqualification", but nothing about bankruptcy.
"(Annexe 7 :
Etat provisoire des créances)
Dont provisionnel :
000 000 €
INSUFFISANCE D'ACTIF :
0 000 000 €
Que Monsieur AAA peut être poursuivi au titre des mesures de faillite personnelle ou d'interdiction de gérer conformément à l'article L.653-1 du Code de commerce :"
"Sued for personal bankruptcy"? There is 1 hit for this on the InterOuèbbe. I also looked up "sued for bankruptcy on a personal basis" - nada. OTOH there are 135,000 hits for "sued for bankruptcy". And yet the phrase must make the fact of it being *personal* (as opposed to corporate) bankruptcy clear.
Also the whole au titre des mesures de faillite personnelle expression looks a bit suspect. Are these "steps" involved in declaring someone bankrupt maybe? Or are they simply "the procedure" for making someone bankrupt? Either way, how to convey that?
I also looked up article 653 (Légifrance English translation): in the version I saw there's lots about "personal disqualification", but nothing about bankruptcy.
Proposed translations
(English)
Proposed translations
+1
19 mins
Eliza Hall
United States
United States
Native in English
Specializes in field
United States
Lawyer-Translator-Certified Interpreter
Native in: English (Variants: US, Scottish, Canadian, Irish, British, UK)
Works in: French to English, English to French
Related KudoZ points
:
145
Selected
subject to involuntary personal bankruptcy
In the US, creditors can force a debtor into personal bankruptcy even if the debtor doesn't want to declare bankruptcy:
https://www.investopedia.com/terms/i/involuntary-bankruptcy....
In France, it seems that can be done, and there's also an option of subjecting the person to a prohibition against managing a company: https://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/codes/article_lc/LEGIARTI0000...
https://www.investopedia.com/terms/i/involuntary-bankruptcy....
In France, it seems that can be done, and there's also an option of subjecting the person to a prohibition against managing a company: https://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/codes/article_lc/LEGIARTI0000...
Note from asker:
| Thanks, that's really helpful actually. I'm not quite clear how you'd work <i>poursuivre</i> into that...? Just "... can be made subject to... "? |
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
philgoddard
: Maybe, to answer the asker's additional question, you could add "proceedings" at the end.".
2 hrs
|
|
Yes, that's a good idea.
|
|
| neutral |
Adrian MM.
: Involuntary is compulsory, besides which this answer skips the precursor stage '...au titre des mesures...' as in 'une mise en demeure'.
25 days
|
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Thanks"
-2
28 mins
Conor McAuley
France
France
Native in English
Specializes in field
France
Excellence, Expertise & Experience
Native in: English (Variants: Wales / Welsh, UK, Scottish, Irish, British)
Works in: French to English, English
Related KudoZ points
:
210
prosecuted under personal bankruptcy measures
Mistake by the lawyer with the article number I think:
"LEGISLATIVE PART
BOOK VI: DIFFICULTIES FACED BY BUSINESSES
TITLE V: LIABILITIES AND SANCTIONS
CHAPTER IV: CRIMINAL BANKRUPTCY AND OTHER OFFENCES
Section 1: Criminal bankruptcy
Article L. 654-1
The provisions of this section shall apply to:
1° All natural persons engaged in a retail activity or artisanal trade, any
farmer, and any natural person running an independent professional
activity, including an independent professional person with a statutory or
regulated status or whose designation is protected;
2° Persons who, directly or indirectly, de jure or de facto, have managed
or liquidated a private law entity;
3° Natural persons, who serve as permanent representatives of the
managing legal entities referred to under (2°) above."
(I came across it by mistake.)
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 31 mins (2021-02-03 18:31:17 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
"personal bankruptcy"
767,000 ghits
https://www.google.co.uk/search?ei=u-gaYLL8I4GclwSdwJjwBg&q=...
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2021-02-03 19:14:46 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Well, not entirely by mistake, I was heading up towards 654!
Napoleon and lucky generals.
Note from asker:
| "I came across it by mistake". Just when I was preparing to "salute your indefatigability". In the English version of 654 I've just looked at it seems to be talking about "criminal bankruptcy". I just got the latest French version from Légifrance and, goddam, 654 has basically disappeared. Versioning! Bane of the 21st C. |
Peer comment(s):
| disagree |
Eliza Hall
: In EN legalese, private parties don't "prosecute" other parties. You see "prosecute" in EN in (1) criminal cases, and (2) intellectual property (e.g. "patent prosecution": drafting and submitting a patent application...).
3 hrs
|
|
Fair enough, maybe. "have an action brought against him..." then?
|
|
| disagree |
Daryo
: also strongly on a point of method: what is "personal bankruptcy" 767,000 ghits EXACTLY suppose to prove???
1 day 5 hrs
|
|
THAT the two words are collocated reasonably often.
|
-1
3 hrs
Adrian MM.
Austria
Austria
Native in English
Specializes in field
Austria
Retd.T&I, Barrister & Austro-Advokat
Native in: English (Variants: Scottish, British) 
Works in: Spanish to English, English to Spanish, French to English, and 5 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
359
have steps taken against him (E&W: stat. demand) triggering an adjudication of personal insolvency
I agree the distinction is drawn in E&W between personal bankruptcy vs. corporate insolvency, bar US Chapter 11 etc. corporate bankruptcy etc., but there is a tendency these days to talk about (adjudication of) 'personal insolvency'.
North of the Border, bankruptcy is labelled 'sequestration'.
In E&W, the director could (pace the other contributors) be served with a pre-bankruptcy statutory demand often (mis-)used as a nuclear debt-collection option.
'Steps' leaves open suing in civil or prosecuted in criminal proceedings.
Coincidentally, such a debtor scenario is close to the one of the Canadian director 'pursued' (and successfully arrested before reaching the pro-debtor Delaware courts) across the US border by my chartered accountant-cum- insolvency practitioner English-qualifed schoolfriend out of Vancouver BC.
North of the Border, bankruptcy is labelled 'sequestration'.
In E&W, the director could (pace the other contributors) be served with a pre-bankruptcy statutory demand often (mis-)used as a nuclear debt-collection option.
'Steps' leaves open suing in civil or prosecuted in criminal proceedings.
Coincidentally, such a debtor scenario is close to the one of the Canadian director 'pursued' (and successfully arrested before reaching the pro-debtor Delaware courts) across the US border by my chartered accountant-cum- insolvency practitioner English-qualifed schoolfriend out of Vancouver BC.
Example sentence:
Muir Hunter QC on Personal Insolvency is the definitive reference work on personal insolvency.
A guide to statutory demands in the context of personal and corporate insolvency.
Peer comment(s):
| disagree |
AllegroTrans
: Far too anglo-centric again; + the courts since the Woolf et al reforms are rather more inclined to simply speak of bankruptcy orders than of adjudications in bankruptcy; asfaiaw France doesn't use stat demands as a precursor to bankuptcy
1 hr
|
|
Be that as it may and France most definitely has an equivalent in a *mise en demeure*, the question refers to : '...au titre des mesures...' and not the proceedings themseles.
|
5 hrs
AllegroTrans
United Kingdom
United Kingdom
Native in English
Specializes in field
United Kingdom
Sensible solutions
Native in: English (Variant: Wessexois) 
Works in: French to English, English, English to French
Related KudoZ points
:
1355
have bankruptcy proceedings against him
If your target audience is GB or Rireland, "personal" is inherent in the translation. Only in the US can bankruptcy also be against companies. But adding "personal" would do no harm.
Talking of statutory demands and adjudications imo is far too GB slanted in my opinion
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 5 hrs (2021-02-03 23:50:44 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
As Eliza says, we don't have a neat way of expressing "poursuivi" (at least not for civil proceedings) in one word, as in French. "Issued against him" would cover this. "Prosecuted" doesn't work as it implies criminality.
Whilst Eliza's suggestion certainly is not "wrong" a debtor doesn't suddenly become "subject" to bankruptcy unless either 1) a creditor (E&W) files a bankruptcy petition and the debtor does not pay the debt, resulting in a bankruptcy order, or 2) the debtor files his/her own petiton, effectively declaring himself/herself bankrupt
Talking of statutory demands and adjudications imo is far too GB slanted in my opinion
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 5 hrs (2021-02-03 23:50:44 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
As Eliza says, we don't have a neat way of expressing "poursuivi" (at least not for civil proceedings) in one word, as in French. "Issued against him" would cover this. "Prosecuted" doesn't work as it implies criminality.
Whilst Eliza's suggestion certainly is not "wrong" a debtor doesn't suddenly become "subject" to bankruptcy unless either 1) a creditor (E&W) files a bankruptcy petition and the debtor does not pay the debt, resulting in a bankruptcy order, or 2) the debtor files his/her own petiton, effectively declaring himself/herself bankrupt
Peer comment(s):
| neutral |
Adrian MM.
: poursuivi could be mesures such as 'une mise en demeure', with the proceedings being further along the line in FRE.
25 days
|
Discussion
That turn of phrase is used in a vast range of contexts: You may be subject to termination of employment... You may be subject to criminal prosecution... You may be subject to sanctions... You may be subject to deportation... You may be subject to penalties set forth under the Military Code of Justice... etc. etc.
"Blanket" because "pursuant to" covers so much with blandness, and also provides comfort (while also sounding scary and legal).