PLUNET etc.: please send me a message once my translation is "approved for invoicing"!
Thread poster: Luca Tutino
Luca Tutino
Luca Tutino  Identity Verified
Italy
Member (2002)
English to Italian
+ ...
Mar 10, 2021

Plunet and similar management systems make it literally impossible to invoice a completed job for several days, sometimes weeks. Which is unfair and probably illegal in most places.

Not a single agency using such systems has ever agreed to send me a message once my delivered translation is "approved for invoicing". I understand that most systems do not provide such an option.

Also, Plunet make it impossible to date the invoice back to the delivery date. This magically
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Plunet and similar management systems make it literally impossible to invoice a completed job for several days, sometimes weeks. Which is unfair and probably illegal in most places.

Not a single agency using such systems has ever agreed to send me a message once my delivered translation is "approved for invoicing". I understand that most systems do not provide such an option.

Also, Plunet make it impossible to date the invoice back to the delivery date. This magically extends payment terms for an undetermined period, not rarely for more than 30 days, in connection with "EOM" tems. Which seems very unfair.

Moreover, as a result, I am supposed to go back to the client's Plunet URL for an undetermined number of days in order to know whether my invoice has been accepted or not. Which is an unfair use of my time.

And if, after several days, I misplace my note and forget to continue checking, I am at risk of losing entirely the payment for my work. Is this fair?

I have been complaining without success about this for years. Now I see that, unfortunately, such management systems, and in particular Plunet, are extremely popular. I'd like to know if any other colleague finds such systems unfair and if, for once, it would be possible to work together to put some pressure on the software producers and on the agencies to grant us the right to a timely invoice.
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Elena Feriani
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Nathanael Fourie
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Nathanael Fourie
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Member (2015)
Norwegian to English
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Communicate your concerns to your clients Mar 10, 2021

I'd say, depending on how healthy your cashflow situation might be, communicate this exact issue to the respective agency/agencies you're experiencing the problem with. One could probably send your own invoices to them on delivery date, just so you have a record of when you actually invoiced them and so that they get the message that you're not prepared to wait until they eventually avail the option to invoice on Plunet.

If you've experienced the same problem countless times with a
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I'd say, depending on how healthy your cashflow situation might be, communicate this exact issue to the respective agency/agencies you're experiencing the problem with. One could probably send your own invoices to them on delivery date, just so you have a record of when you actually invoiced them and so that they get the message that you're not prepared to wait until they eventually avail the option to invoice on Plunet.

If you've experienced the same problem countless times with a particular client, it could help to refuse future work from them (if financially viable) and/or agree to take on projects based on the condition that you'd be able to upload your invoice within a certain turnaround time after having delivered your work.

That's my two cents to the topic.
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3089491 (X)
3089491 (X)  Identity Verified
Luxembourg
Local time: 13:03
Assumptions Mar 11, 2021

The assumption here seems to be that the agency wants to prevent the immediate delivery of the invoice. It is, however, possible this setting was not the agency's choice. It could be a default option that can be easily changed by the administrator.

More and more things will be initially decided by a software developer, based on his/her worldview and specific knowledge of the respective specialist field.


Luca Tutino
 
finnword1
finnword1
United States
Local time: 08:03
English to Finnish
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I don't think it is Plunet's fault. Mar 11, 2021

My best customer uses Plunet, and always notifies me by email when a job has been approved. If your customer does not do that, it's because they don't want to, or they don't know how to.

 
Denzel Watson
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United States
Local time: 05:03
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Samuel Murray
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Netherlands
Local time: 13:03
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
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@Luca Mar 11, 2021

Luca Tutino wrote:
Plunet and similar management systems make it literally impossible to invoice a completed job for several days, sometimes weeks.


That is true, but sometimes this is due to negligence by project managers. If you find that you can't invoice yet even though a reasonable period of time has passed since delivery, you must take this up with the project manager and request that he updates the job in the system so that you can invoice for it.

Not a single agency using such systems has ever agreed to send me a message once my delivered translation is "approved for invoicing". I understand that most systems do not provide such an option.


Unfortunately, this is true. But it shouldn't be a bother. After all, you have a spreadsheet with all the jobs that you did, including a column that indicates whether you have already submitted an invoice, and a column that shows the approximate date from which you should be able to submit the invoice, and when the cells in that column turn red (or green, depending on your setup), you know that it's time to invoice for that job.

This not knowing when Plunet etc. is ready for invoicing is only a problem if you don't keep track of jobs and invoicing information. E.g. if you're the type of translator with a very simple administration that assumes that all jobs can be invoiced immediately or within X number of days after delivery or e.g. once a week.

Also, Plunet make it impossible to date the invoice back to the delivery date. This magically extends payment terms for an undetermined period, not rarely for more than 30 days...


Yes, and unfortunately this is something that the translator discovers after working for the client for a while (it is rarely stated upfront exactly how long the delays are going to be). But once you have figured out what the typical delay is for a particular client, you can update your client or invoice spreadsheet with this information so that you know what to expect in future. It simply means that for that client, the distance between delivery and payment is not e.g. 14+30 days but 30+14+30 days.

Moreover, as a result, I am supposed to go back to the client's Plunet URL for an undetermined number of days in order to know whether my invoice has been accepted or not.


It is annoying, yes, but it shouldn't take too much of your time to do so, should it? Just schedule such checks regularly (e.g. once a week, for all jobs that have red (or green) boxes in your spreadsheet).

And if ... I misplace my note and forget to continue checking, I am at risk of losing entirely the payment for my work. Is this fair?


What is fair is that you run a business and you must have a proper office administration that does not rely on loose notes to keep track of things to do.


[Edited at 2021-03-11 07:41 GMT]


 
3089491 (X)
3089491 (X)  Identity Verified
Luxembourg
Local time: 13:03
Running a proper business Mar 11, 2021

Samuel Murray wrote:

What is fair is that you run a business and you must have a proper office administration that does not rely on loose notes to keep track of things to do.


Good point. What should be important is delivering agreed quality at agreed time.

There are services for which people pay in advance. Maybe we should try that.


 
Luca Tutino
Luca Tutino  Identity Verified
Italy
Member (2002)
English to Italian
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TOPIC STARTER
Good advise but not sufficient Mar 12, 2021

Nathanael Fourie wrote:

I'd say, depending on how healthy your cashflow situation might be, communicate this exact issue to the respective agency/agencies you're experiencing the problem with. One could probably send your own invoices to them on delivery date, just so you have a record of when you actually invoiced them and so that they get the message that you're not prepared to wait until they eventually avail the option to invoice on Plunet.

If you've experienced the same problem countless times with a particular client, it could help to refuse future work from them (if financially viable) and/or agree to take on projects based on the condition that you'd be able to upload your invoice within a certain turnaround time after having delivered your work.

That's my two cents to the topic.


I agree with you, and I have been doing all of the above for years. And yet, it keeps being more and more annoying.


 
Luca Tutino
Luca Tutino  Identity Verified
Italy
Member (2002)
English to Italian
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TOPIC STARTER
I do not understand such off topic points Mar 12, 2021

Mihai Badea wrote:

Samuel Murray wrote:

What is fair is that you run a business and you must have a proper office administration that does not rely on loose notes to keep track of things to do.


Good point. What should be important is delivering agreed quality at agreed time.

There are services for which people pay in advance. Maybe we should try that.


Of course I also do that. My point is that the software encourages unfair practices and, by so doing, it manipulates the market to our disadvantage.


Adieu
 
Luca Tutino
Luca Tutino  Identity Verified
Italy
Member (2002)
English to Italian
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Do you get automated emails upon approval? Mar 12, 2021

finnword1 wrote:

My best customer uses Plunet, and always notifies me by email when a job has been approved. If your customer does not do that, it's because they don't want to, or they don't know how to.


This is not what I have been told by different clients. Are you sure that those are not manual messages sent by sensible PMs? (Occasionally I managed to get them too.)

I hope it is a new feature, it would be good news to me.

[Edited at 2021-03-12 17:13 GMT]


 
Luca Tutino
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Italy
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English to Italian
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It actually takes a lot of time Mar 12, 2021

@Samuel, once you start having a certain number of such clients, it takes time and effort, considering the different rules for login maintenance, and the fact that the waiting time for "approval" is mostly random. Moreover, every client has different rules about wether you should add an internal number and/or upload your invoice, etc , which can create further delays and additional actions.

 
Adieu
Adieu  Identity Verified
Ukrainian to English
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Sounds like a variation on the old "rebate" and "gift card" scams Mar 27, 2021

Simply paying out money costs 100% of what you owe... creating additional steps lowers that number somewhat.

Somebody somewhere did some math and found that a certain delay and requiring a certain number of manual actions at a later date to get paid lead to a certain % of jobs that NEVER get billed

It is an intentional "cost-cutting" measure

[Edited at 2021-03-27 06:40 GMT]

[Edited at 2021-03-27 06:41 GMT]


 


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PLUNET etc.: please send me a message once my translation is "approved for invoicing"!







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